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barend

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Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by "Sitarfixer"
When I was co-cranking sitars with the Miraj homies, the C# -D question always came up when the spec list was being put together. Any sitar that was going to be set up for D tuning was automatically set with a scale length 1 1/2" shorter than the C# scale length. Makes sense, doesn't it !?!
Didn't know that. What I noticed about my sitars when tuned to D is that they had slightly less meend range because of the D tuning (compared to the same sitar in C# tuning). Is that true or normal?
I have played in D for some years but now I am back to C#. I keep one sitar in D because it is sort of a must if you play fusion stuff with other (western) instruments.
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povster

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Reply with quote  #17 
A question for Tony - I do agree with the shorter string length for a D tuning sonically, but the question was how they would hold up. Do you feel a good instrument is in danger being tuned to D? I've never seen any indication of that myself.

Here are some of my own experiences with the C# vs D issue. Around 1978 I was using a beautiful Hemen #2. For a time my teacher had changed to D tuning on his 60's Hiren #1 rather than C#. I followed suit. Both instruments held up just fine structurally. For a while I was even using a #4 bajtar but ended up changing back to #3 as it was just too much for my hands over time. the years I have had other sitars good sitars I had tuned to D. They were always tuned back to C# because they just sounded better there.

My Barun travel sitar had a 1/2" shorter string length than a standard sitar. When I first heard it and knew I wanted to own it it was tuned to D due to the shorter length (not Tony's 1 1/2" but just 1/2"). It did sound amazing in D. When I was playing it for a bit I decided to see how it sounded at C#. It sounded just as good but with a slightly more - how to phrase it - "mature" sound. So I left it at C#.

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zachbram

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Reply with quote  #18 
I also prefer C# tuning but my teacher plays in D so its good to know that a sitar can handle both without having panic attacks about the neck breaking in half if that now even can happen... haha. thanks everybody for the information youve given me!
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Sitarfixer

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Reply with quote  #19 
Seems with all this income generating fusion stuff being the rage right now, everybody is cranking up to D. Logical move. The guitar pickers and grinners love that D. Any quality sitar can handle the tension of going up to D. What that pitch shift does to the overall life span of the instrument is too soon to tell. The added tension could possibly increase the bow in the neck. With that, the bridges will need to be lowered to maintain that magic 10mm. fret clearance for the open MA string to fret #20. Chikari post, the high one, will usually need to be replaced if the bridge lowering isn't enough to keep the height of all the top strings in line as seen from the side. Tuning to D reduces the meend range a little bit - obviously. Tuning the SA down to C or even B will boost the meend range quite a bit, as well as increase the cheeze factor. Thicker MA string would help I suppose. THere is a possibility that a bridge shift might be necessary if any fret shifting to accomodate the new string / neck tension isn't enough. At this point, the instrument is becoming kit bashed and getting to where it's being used in areas out of bounds. Scratch those itches and see what you end up with. Just don't mess up your baby.
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rex@sitar.co.za

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Reply with quote  #20 
Ok, so the 1 1/2" shorter scale is really just to make meends slightly easier to play in D?
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barend

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Reply with quote  #21 
Quote:
Originally Posted by "Sitarfixer"
Tuning to D reduces the meend range a little bit - obviously. Tuning the SA down to C or even B will boost the meend range quite a bit, as well as increase the cheeze factor. Thicker MA string would help I suppose.
thanks for clarifying, good to know that I'm not crazy after all. On the sitar that I tune in D I also use a slightly thinner Ma string to compensate for the extra tension. I think that thinner string reduces the meend range also (?).
It is really noticable. On my sitar tuned to C# I can meend from (middle) Sa to komal Dha. On the in D the komal Dha is not possible (no more space on the neck). From Sa to just above Pa is the limit.
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barend

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Reply with quote  #22 
Sorry to dig up this topic. But what would be decent price for an old Hiren Roy KP style in good condition? Say one from the 70's or late 70's. Just curious.
Thanks.
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Blind Lemon Mike

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Reply with quote  #23 
I am looking for one since quite a while. I've seen them offered fom 800 (half deco) up to 2500 € in Europe (through a dealer) . But most of them were not quite as old, more late 80s and younger...

Not sure if that helps...

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Michael
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barend

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Reply with quote  #24 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Lemon Mike
I am looking for one since quite a while. I've seen them offered fom 800 (half deco) up to 2500 € in Europe (through a dealer) . But most of them were not quite as old, more late 80s and younger...

Not sure if that helps...

regards
Michael


Thanks. Is there a way to tell from the badge from which year they are? Like the most common white badge with the more square letters. I think that is late 70s early 80s?
Like the second and third badge here: http://www.sitarfactory.be/tag/hiren-roy/
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Blind Lemon Mike

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Reply with quote  #25 
My Teachers Hiren Roy was made by Himanghu Roy, Baruns older Brother who passed away in 1997. It was from the early nineties (If i remember correctly 94) and it still hat the old "classic" label. 

Another player i know purchased his in 2004 an it also still has the classic label. 

India-Instrument, a well-known German importer says the Purpleish/Brown Label of Barun Roy was introduced in 2008 after the shop was closed in 2007 and Barun started working from his home. 

There are a few that have a Barun-Roy Label but with a different colour, sort of beige...

they look like this: 

hirenroy_voll4_gross.jpg 

theese should be earlier than the purpleish/brown models.... so the transition is somewhere around this period. 

take that with a grain of salt though, I have not nearly seen as many instruments as other around here.... maybe Lars could chime in on this topic. 

regards Michael


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barend

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Reply with quote  #26 
Good info Blind melon Mike! thanks.
I like the more brownish color of the paint on the white side decoration on above picture, instead of the usual reddish on Barun Roy sitars.
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Blind Lemon Mike

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Reply with quote  #27 
yeah, I always wondered why that is, that the appearance changes constantly. 

As far as i know, the craftsman that do these designs also change constantly, since it's not barun himself who does the penwork... 

I would like to learn about all this tings myself and i wish i had the knowledge of some of the old-cats on this forum about these things.

regards

Michael
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